Dysnomia

Aren't they on DSM-V now?

Someone on /r/conspiracy was spewing bs about transfolk having mental illness but that was in the DSM-IV and DSM-V had actually removed dysphoria as a mental illness.

Fuck the DSM anyway tho.

slightly

see you cant just stop. grow up man.

Calvin

A world where Scientology has a point about psychology is a truly insane world.

alsyd

They say a lot of legitimate stuff but then use that to make a cult and scam people for profit...

Greasetrap

What do they say, out of curiosity?

Calvin

There have been a number of controversies between Scientology and psychiatry since the founding of the Church of Scientology in 1952. Scientology is publicly, and often vehemently, opposed to both psychiatry and psychology.[1][2][3] Scientologists view psychiatry as a barbaric and corrupt profession and encourage alternative care based on spiritual healing. According to the Church of Scientology, psychiatry has a long history of improper and abusive care. The group's views have been disputed, criticized and condemned by experts in the medical and scientific community and been a source of public controversy.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scientology_and_psychiatry

slightly

looking at this nothing the article states reflects its targeting nonconformity and freethinking. Especially mentions nothing of trying to suppress creative thought. pretty much it says if your child is being an outright asshole for 6 months straight they might have Oppositional defiant disorder . I wish i could downvote

Signs and symptoms were: actively refuses to comply with majority's requests or consensus-supported rules;[5] performs actions deliberately to annoy others;[5] is angry and resentful of others;[4] argues often;[4] blames others for their own mistakes;[6] frequently loses temper;[6] is spiteful or seeks revenge;[6] and is touchy or easily annoyed.[6]

alsyd

Isn't "actively refuses to comply with majority's requests or consensus-supported rules" the exact same thing as nonconformity?

slightly

nonconformity is a buzzword. it is not the word used by the actual manual.

alsyd

non·con·form·i·ty : failure or refusal to conform to a prevailing rule or practice.

That's the EXACT same as one of the symptoms : actively refuses to comply with majority's requests or consensus-supported rules

slightly

i didnt say it didnt mean what you are saying. but the article specifically decided to use that word for a reason. not because its what was medically used but its what gets attention. it gets the attention of people who hear conformity as a bad thing. which most people do. People want to be an individual. Most people are special little people and will never want to choose to conform to other people. thats why it s a buzzword. it gets an emotional response. if the article title read consenus-supported rules. no one would give a shit and click on there stupid little article. which was a paragraph long and had no links to the actual manual they were talking about. cause they know that people clickbaiting on an emotional response will most likely not actually research and find out they were bullshitting for the views.

alsyd

All of what you said is an opinion and it's pretty baseless since it's talking about the intention of the author. We are talking about the usage of the word nonconformity and the author correctly used the word because nonconformity is explicitly described as one of the symptoms.

Why are you even changing the subject man? I agree with part of your original comment that the author was nonsensically saying this is against freethinking (it could be with a very extreme interpretation) but I was just comment on what seemed like how you were implying that it's using the word nonconformity inaccurately which is, as I've proven totally wrong.

slightly

All of what i said is an opinion? thats not true at all. Because its a fact the author used the word nonconformity and the manual didnt. that is a fact. and i agreed the nonconformity has the definition equal to.

the author chose that one specific word for a reason. that is a fact.

the author didnt link the manual. that is a fact.

i wouldnt say all of what i said is an opinion or baseless?

i didnt change the subject. i was pretty on the nose to what you want to talk about plus some.

and once again the one trait alone is not merit to seek therapy. 4 together are. and the article didnt even directly quote 4 from the manual. specifically chose a few and reworded it to the author's benefit. the article doesnt even

you are ignoring my other comment and focusing on something so minor. you are just being combative and arguing for no reason now. you are not helping along a good and healthy discussion. so from this point im done responding to you. its obvious you just want to argue about nothing.

alsyd

Those facts can have many implications but no one can prove the implications. You said some of these implications, and if you are saying these implications are true then that is your opinion. The implications were how you think those facts about the article were chosen for the author's benefit and talking about the author's benefit can't be factual unless the author says so...

Plus some? That means you were changing the subject... Anyways you're just ignoring what I posted because I fully explained what I wanted to talk about and you're not talking about it at all. I never said that one trait is enough to seek therapy what makes you think that? Now you're just putting false words into my mouth.

You are the one being combative and arguing for no reason man... What a cop out LMFAO. If I am ignoring your comment you can point out what I am ignoring and we can talk about it dude....

I even said I agreed with the general idea of your original comment and now you're just accusing me of combative? Really now?

voatergoater

Why downvoat?

ImmaHermit

Is nonconformity and freethinking a mental illness? According to the newest addition of the DSM-IV (Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders), it certainly is.

This is just rhetoric from the article's author.

The manual identifies a new mental illness called “oppositional defiant disorder” or ODD. Defined as an “ongoing pattern of disobedient, hostile and defiant behavior,” symptoms include questioning authority, negativity, defiance, argumentativeness, and being easily annoyed.

That's the actual definition and it sounds like it's describing SJWs.

partycrasher

The Faint disagrees: Symptom Finger

Gross that most mass school shootings have one thing in common: The shooters were all on anti-depressants.

fleetfoot

Yeah, but... I dunno, man, that seems like it may just be correlation, not causation. I would say most school shooters are actually sick in the head, and it's not a stretch to imagine they were drugged up after seeing a shrink. Whether or not the drugs help is arguable, but it's not uncommon for sick fucks to be on some sort of medication or another.

Deathstalker

From the same industry that brought us Female Hysteria now known as Tumblr Syndrome.

Edit: Oh wait Stefan Molyneux is a fucking nutcase. Check out Thunderf00t's videos on him.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lN5OjzEfQmI

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4-67C2htgI4

WhatTheFuckIsGoingOn

New mental illnesses identified by the DSM-IV include arrogance, narcissism, above-average creativity, cynicism, and antisocial behavior.

Oh shit looks like you're too creative, better give you some drugs. What the hell is wrong with the people who make this manual?

slightly

i cant find the link to the manual. the article seems to making a lot of their own quotes.

id

Yeah I'm struggling to find validation for these statements

slightly

multiple sites state the symptoms as listed. the wikipedia page for Oppositional defiant disorder will list them. the articles seem to be trying to stir unnecessary hate. or really bored writers. they sure did get OP's attention.

the disorder could just be asshold child disorder.

Signs and symptoms were: actively refuses to comply with majority's requests or consensus-supported rules;[5] performs actions deliberately to annoy others;[5] is angry and resentful of others;[4] argues often;[4] blames others for their own mistakes;[6] frequently loses temper;[6] is spiteful or seeks revenge;[6] and is touchy or easily annoyed.[6]

alsyd

Dude what? This can easily be abused man. Are you telling me that someone with the following traits should be drugged and/or get therapy?

actively refuses to comply with majority's requests or consensus-supported rules

argues often;

blames others for their own mistakes

is touchy or easily annoyed

That probably counts for like a quarter of this subreddit (or on reddit at least). I'm not saying those traits are necessarily a good thing but to say they are symptoms of a disorder is more than pushing it and is just sounding like 1984 to me.

slightly

no one said anything about drugs. but if you read the article you have to have 6 of the eight for them to consider you as a possible case of ODD. Consider. Possible. 6 out of 8. you only chose 3. because the other 5 are universal asshole traits. And therapy does not hurt anyone.

alsyd

No. It says 4. Where did you read 6? If it was 6 then that would be quite a bit better. I read 4 so that's why I picked the 4 most harmless symptoms to prove a point

slightly

my mistake if thats what it says. even with those 4 traits together is an extremely difficult person to be around. im not worried about faceless people online. but if my child was acting that way, for their own benefit i would help them get to the root of the problem and find a solution get them a happier life.

If you let just those "harmless traits" fester its going to breed more traits. they will have no friends from pushing them all away and end committing a scoial suicide. grow up and be another withdrawn individual in their own bubble. these are the people that end up going on shooting sprees. these are the people we outcry over because we have no way of identifying their problems early and helping them.

refusing to comply to the consensus standard

easily be on grounds of a lack of empathy. its a standard to benefit everyone. its a consensus for a reason. not stealing is a consensus standard

argues often

debating is one thing. arguing is destructive and does not bring upon progress. often? we dont need it all the time from someone ignoring the consensus standard. he is obviously alone in his views.

blames others for their mistakes

well now we have someone who is following their own rules and arguing with the consensus constantly that their way is the best making mistakes and blaming their mistakes on everyone else but themselves. apparently he does not know everything and maybe should stop arguing and take a look at the consensus standards. maybe they are agreed upon for a reason.

touchy or easily annoyed

what does this person possibly have to be annoyed with now? no one is excusing him for being an asshole? he feels alone? this is the trait that will start to tip someone off maybe the person needs help.

the 4 seperatly are innocent enough. but together is recipe of something might be wrong.

alsyd

I severely disagree. Oh my you edited it into double the size. 3 more paragraphs I have to type now, oh well. Refusing to comply to the consensus standard means a lack of empathy? It's a consensus for a reason? Do you know what sub you are on? The consensus rules that criticism of Israel equates to antisemitism. Is it a benefit for everyone to ignore the crimes against humanity in Palestine? (Every year the UN condemns Israel to no effect)

Debating is literally the exact same thing as arguing. If "we don't need it all the time" then we can leave the individual alone. Unless he is bothering people himself, just the act of arguing is not bad and is very good since differing viewpoints can always add to the discussion. This is different from quarreling or causing a ruckus, and if simply arguing is actually going to be used as a symptom in the newest DSM then it can very easily be abused to influence parents to drug perfectly normal kids.

Blaming others others for their mistakes can be bad if someone is going around yelling at everyone how they are causing their mistakes, but if they are saying nothing until someone accuses them of a mistake and then they say the cause of what is being accused is not them? That's not bad at all. Saying the trait of blaming others for their mistakes is too broad and can be much too easily abused.

The first 3 traits together signify cynicism and that isn't a bad trait. This whole sub is based on cynicism! Refusing to comply, arguing and blaming others is ridiculously normal and honestly I would encourage that type of thing! For the last trait though. being touchy and easily annoyed would be if when one is in a bad mood which can easily happen through watching news or just generally being aware of the atrocities or being appalled at the ignorance.

Sure one would have to learn how to take their mind of such things and have a good enough attitude for social interaction but that's pretty simple and doesn't need therapy let alone drugs or anything. Yet all of a sudden if someone shows these 4 traits, a psychiatrist can easily recommend psychiatric medication (aka drugs) for them?

This is Orwellian as fuck and is a very big cause for concern

slightly

its people like you that gives this sub a bad name.

alsyd

How so? I could say the exact same thing about you. PS you should really read 1984 it's an eye opener

slightly

dude you have to be trolling now. that book is terrible. I know you have not read the whole thing. if you are serious you only read the beginning of the book. its the only thing thats worth anything. i cant believe you just told me to read 1984. lol literally reddits bible. they thump that book in every comment thread. are you moling for reddit right now?

alsyd

I rest my case

slightly

your comments are showing your age. 1984 may be very impressionable for someone so young. your views are so narrowed. I hope you dont have a social disorder. when you graduate high school i hope you log out and shut your computer off. move out of her home town and talk to some people and listen. look and learn about the world you live in. sadly i can tell you have only experience the world through subreddits and clickbait articles. you are becoming the exact person you dont want to be. slowly programmed over the years by being systamaticaly hypnotized by the tv and internet. you have no opinions of your own. you sound like any other person commenting. no individuality to your statements. cookie cutter at most.

alsyd

I'm 22 with many intelligent friends. Also 1984 is taught in many universities and is assigned to be analyzed so I have no idea what you're talking about. Personally speaking I think Brave New World is a more accurate depiction of the issues modern society is faced but we can learn much to heed the warnings of both authors. Huxley especially says some very enlightening things.

Maybe you should type properly before telling someone to learn... Unless you are gonna stop using ad hominem and other logical fallacies I think I am done here.

slightly

bye

old_soul

OP here, thanks for debunking this. I got baited by the fear porn and did not fact check the article. I kind of feel stupid now for spreading misinformation.

alsyd

This is not "debunked" I've seen this posted on a lot of different sites long ago. I came here to post this as old news but am now getting alarmed that some people are thinking this as not a big deal...

slightly

Its all good man. Without being too big of a cynic its nice to try and argue yourself and call bullshit internally to anything you agree and disagree with. I was just reading the article and it came off more emotional in tone than anything.

it seems like this disorder is on the books to early identify social disorders and narcissism early in young and adolescent children. Which is a good thing. Narcissists tend to be very destructive to themselves and the people around them. Personal observations seem to be very unhappu and alone after the age of 50. So the early you catch it the more likely you can help them. A narcissist being a narcissist will never seek help on their own having to admit their is a defect with them and not being a perfect individual.

id

That does kinda sound like abnormality tbh, deliberately annoying someone is a douchebag move

gnosticpostulant

Every time I read about the DSM's new entries, it always makes me think of this .